Rev. Jim Debates an antigay Christian woman

[Rev. Jim Cunningham]

This is an email debate that Rev. Jim is currently having with a Christian woman who posted an anti-gay response in in our Guestbook.

Rachel,
Thank you for visiting GayChristianSurvivors.com. Unfortunately we had to delete your comment in the Guestbook, in which you wrote, "I know God's word said that homosexuality is a sin. God inspired the bible. God doesn't approve so I don't either." If you had actually read the website, you would have seen that THE BIBLE says that your comment is a satanic lie. Your heartless Pharisee reply is no different from the doctrines held by Communists and Nazis and obviously we cannot allow such blasphemous comments on our site. Nowhere does the Word of God condemn anyone for being homosexual (as it is thoroughly proven throughout the site); however, there are quite a number of verses which condemn your self righteous and arrogant judgmentalism. If you have any biblical proof from Scripture that condemns homosexuality which DOES NOT include the subject of Sodom & Gomorrah, Leviticus 18:22 & 20:13, Romans 1:26-27, 1st Corinthians 6:9-11, or 1st Timothy 1:9-11 (which have nothing to do with homosexuality as proven on my site and by HUNDREDS of Christian ministers), please let us know. May the Lord our God teach you mercy through His Holy Word so that you stop condemning His children as Satan does.
-Rev. Jim Cunningham
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Jim,
I know what the bible says. I believe the bible is without error so all the verses condemning homosexuality are correct. If you really believed the bible is without error like your statement of faith said that you did so would you. I mean it's very confusing to me for a person to say that the bible is without error except for the verses concerning homosexuality. It completely makes no sense to me. If you claim that those verses were in error than maybe the verses regarding salvation are in error or maybe the verses regarding premarital sex are also in error. "Nowhere does the Word of God condemn anyone for being homosexual" - Yes that is true but the Word of God does condemn unrepentant sinners. Sorry I have to believe what I know in my heart to be true.
- Rachel

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Rachel,
The problem is that you are a hater. You enjoy hating gay people and therefore you see hatred in Scripture and you have virtually no interest in any other view other than one that supports and promotes your hatred. You want God to hate because you hate. You want God to be vindictive because you are vindictive. You think God should be the way you imagine He should be. Unfortunately, you can't have your way because you do not own God, nor do you own His Word. You do not get to make up your own private interpretations of Scripture just to fit with your warped hatred. you have CHOSEN to hate. You have CHOSEN to recreate God in your image based on your hate. I have provided an entire website of Scripture proving that you are wrong. You have provided nothing except to repeat that in your own fallen human opinion you think that God is a homophobe. You are so insecure in your opinion that you talk in circles and incoherency. For example, in response to my comment that "Nowhere does the Word of God condemn anyone for being homosexual", you yourself said, "YES THAT IS TRUE." So if the Word of God does not condemn someone for being homosexual, by what right and what authority do you condemn anyone? And then you say... "but the Word of God does condemn unrepentant sinners". You don't even know what you are saying. EVERYONE is a sinner. Being a homosexual and being an unrepentant sinner has no relation. It's like saying "Yes it’s true that the Word of God doesn't condemn being black, but the Word of God does condemn unrepentant sinners."

What you are doing is that you are making yourself God. You have made yourself judge and jury and executioner because in your little mind you believe God is this monster in heaven who hates two unrelated adult human beings who are in love. Obviously it doesn't matter to you that Sarah was Abraham's SISTER. Obviously it doesn't matter to you that the only way for the earth to be populated was for Adam & Eve's children to commit incest. Obviously it doesn't matter to you that all of the children of Shem, Ham and Japheth (Noah's sons) had to commit incest to repopulate the planet after the Flood. Obviously it doesn't matter to you that Abraham and David and Israel had multiple spouses. You don't even question those things. They mean nothing to you. But you are so sure that you are right that homosexuality is a sin.

I'd like to say this one last thing to you. If you have ever eaten shrimp, lobster, clams, crabs, oysters, or any meat with blood in it (all meat sold in supermarkets and restaurants), or if you have ever done any work or carried any object or lit a flame on the 7th day of the week (Saturday), or if you wear any garment made of two different materials, the very same Bible that you think condemns homosexuals also says that you are to be stoned to death. And that means that it is you who are the unrepentant sinner.

You clearly do not know the Scriptures, and whatever form of Christianity you claim to be is obviously not biblical Christianity. All you are doing is bringing shame and disgrace on the Word of God (which Paul condemns, by the way). So please keep your hatred to yourself because I have no interest in hearing you spit on the Holy Scriptures. Nobody died and made you judge.
- Rev. Jim

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Jim,
Maybe we should just agree to disagree. I don't think that it's right that you are trying to make me compromise my beliefs and convictions. It's also not right you for to call me a gay hater because that is not true at all. I just don't approve of their behavior that's not the same as hating them. I don't hate anyone. I happen to have a couple of gay friends and I'm very nice and caring to them. Being gay is not the same as being black. You are born with skin color but you are not born gay. Saying you were born gay is like saying you were born a killer or an artist. I have not condemned anyone or anything. I KNOW I'M NOT GOD. Also I worship the same God that you do and I believe in the same bible that you do but I do interpret the Scriptures differently but guess what Jim? That is not a crime. If I'm mistaken about everything than God will let me know not YOU! I think you are bearing false witness against me. Thank God I don't go to your church.
- Rachel

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Whoa, Rachel.

You've said, “I know what the bible says. I believe the bible is without error.” You tell the Truth that the Bible is without error, but you tell a falsehood when you say that you know what the Bible says, because if you knew what the Bible says then you would tremble before God because of your condemnation and hatefulness of others under the guise of holiness.

Remember that you came to my website and posted blasphemous unbiblical satanic condemnation and hate toward a group of people horrifically suffering from people like you, and now you are going to pretend as though I'm the one attacking you? You are an instigator of violence and crimes and murder against gays with your hate speech, and you are a perpetuator of the type of propaganda that leads young gays to suicide. And you have the audacity to say that you are a Christian - a representative of Jesus of Nazareth and the Holy Scriptures? Stop acting like the innocent bystander. You are an accomplice of murder. Christianity is not defined by you or your pastor but by Scripture, and by the definitions of Scripture you most certainly are NOT a Christian, for it is written, “They will know you are Christians BY YOUR LOVE”. But you… you punch us in the face, d**n us, condemn us, make laws against us, commit terror against us – and call it love! You are so full of zealousness that you do not see how hateful you are, and you mistake your hatred for righteousness and piety, just as Hitler did. Your hatred of gays has nothing to do with faith or God but only your own fleshly lust, because when you think of homosexuals the only thing you think of is SEX ACTS. It’s all about SEX to you. And will you be judge of others when you yourself are so guilty?

You say that you don't think it is right that I am trying to make you compromise your beliefs and convictions - yet you had no problem doing the exact same thing by writing your lascivious heterosexist comments on my site. You say you "don't approve" of "the behavior" of gays; but I'd like to know who asked for your approval? And if you are so straight, how do you know what "gay behavior" is? And how is it your business what people do in the privacy of their bedroom, and why is it that you even think that you have the power to dictate what people do in their bedrooms? Not even the Bible dictates sex acts in the bedroom with your spouse, so you can't blame it on God. And if gays are fornicating it is the fault of people like you who have used the Law to bar them from marrying, forcing them to live in fornication. You’ve created the conditions for their sin and then you condemn them for it.

And you say, "If I'm mistaken about everything, then God will let me know, not YOU!" Are you trying to blame GOD for your hatred when in fact you let your perverted heterosexist pastors warp the Scriptures to convince you that God is the same kind of sick bigot that he is? Don't pretend like you got your bigotry from God! Your hatred was TAUGHT to you by others who hate.

I worship the God of Scripture. I do not know what god you worship. The God of the Scriptures is not the god you represent. The god you represent is a god of bias, a god who says "You must earn your salvation by castrating your mind and by doing whatever things Rachel has decided is right." But the God of the Scriptures says, "You are ALL guilty and you are ALL condemned and NONE of you can do ANYTHING to earn salvation; you can obtain salvation ONLY by faith in Me." You, Rachel, teach a god of salvation by works, while the God of the Scriptures offers salvation by faith. You cannot be saved by DOING anything and you cannot be saved by CEASING anything. These are WORKS. Homosexuality is NOT a sex act. Homosexuals are homosexual even if they remain virgins their entire life, just as heterosexuals are still heterosexual even if they remain virgin their entire life. You do not become a heterosexual or a homosexual by a sex act. THEREFORE, this means that you have made yourself the dictator of what particular sex acts mankind is “allowed” to perform. If Rachel doesn’t like it then obviously GOD doesn’t like it and therefore it is a sin; and so no one is allowed to do anything that Rachel doesn’t like. You shove your personal biased lifestyle down our throats and call it the Word of God! How arrogant can you be – you who call yourself a Christian.

The point here, Rachel, is that YOU came to us with your hatred against homosexuality saying that being gay is a sin. But you have failed to present any biblical support for your claims against homosexuals, and now you’re acting like the poor little wounded creature that has been verbally assaulted without provocation! Was it your intent, then, to just stop by, throw a hand grenade, and run away without accountability? Did you think it was ok to come here and say such hateful things and expect that we would just allow a demonic monster like you to harass and hurt innocent people? Do you not know that the Apostle Paul demanded that those who do what you just did should be reprimanded before the entire church to show your crime and to bring fear on the church to ensure that it is not done by others (see 1st Timothy 5:20)? What you did was EVIL and WICKED. You came to us, judging us, and now you will have it that we are the big bad meanies who are judging you?! What kind of sick and twisted church do you go to? It is people like you who will roll out the red carpet to the Antichrist.

May God have mercy on you who have shown no mercy!

-Rev. Jim
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Jim,
I don't persecute. I don't hate. STOP saying lies about me! Stop trying to deceive me. Homosexuality is a SIN and I can't approve of sin. What kind of church leader are you to be tolerant of sin? I can't be tolerant of something that I know in my heart to be a sin. Let's agree to disagree and you take your twisted views of the scriptures and share it with people that share your twisted views. No one has ever killed themselves because of me. Just as I thought, you are trying to deceive me.
Oh another thing. I know me better than you do and this picture you are trying imagine me to be is completely not me. What you are assuming about me that are 100% untrue. The real me is very caring to others and emotional to other people's problems. I'm the type of person to try to stop someone from killing themselves if I happen to be around. I don't want anyone to kill themselves. You are trying to make me sound like a monster and I’m not a monster. You don't even know me but God does. God knows I’m not a monster and that is all that matters to me.
Do you hate me for having an opinion that you disagree with? I feel hate coming from you. I really, really honestly don't hate gay people. I don't want anything bad to happen to gay people. I never wanted to judge and condemn anyone honestly. It's the honest truth. I'm sorry if I ever came across that way. Sometimes I do come on a little too strong. I just get too emotional sometimes.
-Rachel
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Rachel,
Stop saying lies about you? What lies am I saying about you? You keep saying that homosexuality is a sin. That is a lie, therefore you are a liar. You accused God of hating homosexuals in your first email to me, but you never demonstrated WHERE God said this – and that is because you are lying. You have lied about homosexuals and you have lied about God. You still refuse to give ANY biblical proof that God is a bigot. You still refuse to prove that anything on my site is wrong. You refuse to address or refute ANYTHING I’ve said. You keep saying that I have twisted views of Scripture, but you refuse to demonstrate how. You merely keep giving your own opinion that “being gay is a sin”. Everyone has an opinion so your opinion means nothing – only God’s Word holds power in matters of morality and you have provided NO PROOF from Scripture that God said that being homosexual is a sin. If homosexuality is a sin, WHERE does the Bible say this? If I have twisted views, WHERE on my site have I given twisted views? If you are going to be bold enough to open your mouth and insult people, you should be ready to stand your ground, as it is written, “be ready always to give an answer to every man that asketh you a reason…”. But I will tell you why you cannot defend your argument: you did not obey the Scriptures which says STUDY TO SHOW THYSELF APPROVED UNTO GOD. You have no biblical support against homosexuality because there is none. You are merely repeating what someone taught you. If you had STUDIED the Word of God you would have discovered that you are incorrect about homosexuality.

And Rachel, you are incorrect to say that I do not know you. It is written in the Holy Scriptures, spoken by Jesus in Matthew 15:18, “those things which proceed out of the mouth come forth from the heart; and they defile the man. For out of the heart proceed evil thoughts, murders, adulteries, fornications, thefts, FALSE WITNESS, blasphemies.” You yourself have revealed to us who you are; you have spoken out of your mouth what is in your heart – and that which is in your heart is who you are. It is also written, “They will KNOW YOU are Christians by your love.” But you have shown only contempt and not love. You did not come to our website in a friendly manner to introduce yourself and present your opposing position; you did not post any comments in the Forum where others could discuss it with you. Instead you went to the Guestbook where no one could respond, and you dropped your anti-gay bomb and ran away – even though the Guestbook specifically states “We kindly ask that you use the Forum to voice your personal thoughts about homosexuality, the Biblical Faith, and debatable subjects. Spam and anti-gay commentary will be deleted.” On which planet is your actions a demonstration of being “caring”, Rachel?

You ask if I hate you for having a different opinion. It is humorous that you are trying to turn this around on me. Ok then, we’ll play it your way. Do I hate you? No. Hate implies the power to condemn you for doing evil as though I am sinless and free of evil. You and I are fallen from grace and condemned to damnation but and have obtained grace purely by faith in the Son of God. You and I are equals. Therefore I do not hate you. I am ANGRY with you. (And Ephesians 4:26 authorizes anger so long as it is not accompanied by sin). You have spoken a false accusation against my Father in heaven and you have spoken evil against our brothers and sisters who are gay, and I am more than entitled to be angry with you for this. Paul himself once wrote that he was so angry with Peter for teaching a falsehood that he “withstood Peter to his face”! If you knew God, you would never say the things you have said. If you knew God you would be ashamed of what you said in condemning others. Do you truly know God – or do you only know THEOLOGY and DOCTRINES and TRADITIONS which men have invented and taught you?

You say that you are very caring toward others. I have no doubt that you are caring to those who are caring to you and that you demonstrate caring toward people you “approve” of. But if you are claiming that the words you wrote on our site is a demonstration of caring, you must have a very bizarre definition of “caring”. I honestly feel like I am talking to a mentally disabled person when I talk with you because you constantly say off-the-wall and contradictory things! You have demonstrated and spoken from your own mouth that you feel you have the right to condemn people. The punishment for sin is eternity without God in the Lake of Fire. Do you not understand that by saying that being gay is a sin, you are damning gays? You could care less that many of the people you are condemning are believers in the Lord Jesus. You are completely heartless to those who are gay, not caring to understand about them, not caring for the suffering they endure – you don’t even have compassion for fellow Christians who are gay! You shut your ears to them with callus hard-heartedness and a wall of self-righteous superiority. You do as Jesus said, “You shut up the kingdom of God against men.” All you care about is your interpretation of the letter of law and you come in like a merciless bulldozer. And you have the nerve to say that you are a caring person?

You say that you honestly never wanted to judge and condemn anyone. But Rachel, do you not understand that this is exactly what you have done? And you have done so without apology. You go on and on defending yourself while at the same time refusing to defend your accusation. You ignore the Gospel and turn the Law into a weapon to assault those who are not your enemy, ignoring the very heart of the Law – justice, mercy and good faith.

As I read your many emails I grow more confused as to why you continue to defend YOURSELF but you refuse to deal with the issue at hand. YOU have said that being homosexual is a sin. We didn’t come to you for your opinion, YOU came to US and threw your opinion at us. You said, “God knows I’m not a monster and that is all that matters to me.” If that is true, then why do you keep defending your character to me rather than addressing WHAT YOU SAID? I’m not the one making character assassinations – YOU are. YOU are the one who came to us and said that homosexuality is a sin, condemning homosexuals. YOU came to OUR site, yet you accuse me of “trying to deceive” you and “trying to make you compromise your beliefs and convictions”. No one twisted your arm and told you to come to our site. You did that of your own free will, and you also chose to post your hateful message of your own free will.
So, Rachel, do you ever plan on explaining to me WHERE the Bible says that being a homosexual is a sin and WHERE I twisted the Scriptures on my site, or do you just intend to condemn yourself by bringing unsupported accusations against me and against homosexuals? I put the Word of God first, so please, show me from Scripture that homosexuals are going to hell for being homosexual. I will listen.
-Rev. Jim
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CONTINUING DIALOG>>>>>>>

Jim, I don't recall saying God hated homosexuals. What I do remember saying is God doesn't approve. That is not the same as saying God hates them which I know God doesn't hate them. I didn't realize you would have wanted me to post things in your forum. I didn't think I would be wanted there because I have an opposing opinion. You already know which verses say homosexuality is a sin but you have already written them off as mistranslated. I don't believe those translations are wrong. I must believe what the bible says word for word. Oh and I'm not referring to the verses in the Old Testament.
-Rachel
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Rachel,

I have never ever said that the verses you use to assault gays with were mistranslated in the Bible. And if you read my site you would see that I vehemently oppose such a thing. The King James Version of the Bible is a perfect translation of the Majority Text Greek and Hebrew Scriptures (which I also read, and which is why I know your anti-gay interpretation of Scripture is false). What I have said is that anti-gay Christians, like yourself, have INTENTIONALLY RE-INTERPRETED what the ENGLISH Scriptures say in order to justify their bigotry, just as bigots had re-interpreted the Scriptures to justify Black slavery and the subjugation of women and Indians and EVERYONE ELSE that they don’t like, using the Bible as a weapon. Our debate is that you are insisting that the Scriptures say something which they do not say - that you are anti-gay, not the Scriptures, and because you are anti-gay you have allowed yourself to be convinced that those verses are speaking of homosexuality; and you have refused to hear any other perspective, regardless of the mountains of proof against your view, because you are content in your own little warped interpretation of Scripture because the subject of homosexuality is of no personal issue for you.

So you say you aren’t referring to the verses in the Old Testament. I don’t understand why you only use part of the Bible, but so be it. That leaves only one place in the New Testament that you could be referring to – Romans 1:26-27 – which doesn’t say anything about homosexuals. But since people who hate homosexuals randomly picked this verse as their weapon against gays, I’d be glad to discuss it.

The big issue here is that, when the Apostle Paul told the Romans that STRAIGHT MARRIED MEN are forbidden to fornicate with other men, you presumed that this refers to HOMOSEXUALS. And the reason you presume that this refers to homosexuals is because you think that homosexuality is merely a BEHAVIOR. Since you don’t believe that there are heterosexuals AND homosexuals you assume that homosexuals are merely heterosexuals who are committing homosexual ACTS. This view has no foundation in Scripture, but I guess I can see how you would think that since you are only attracted to the opposite gender you therefore can’t imagine anyone else being attracted to the same gender.

I’m right-handed, but writing with my left hand does not make me left-handed – and being right-handed does not prevent me from the ACT of writing with my left hand (unnatural for me though it would be). And just the same, a heterosexual is capable of performing homosexual ACTS (as Paul clearly states) but this does not mean that he is a HOMOSEXUAL. In fact, such a person is NOT a homosexual, which is exactly why Paul spoke against his behavior. How in the world you think this verse is referring to homosexuals, just because some perverted heterosexual left his wife for a man out of lustfulness, is beyond me. If Paul had condemned a right-handed man for using his left hand, that would NOT be a condemnation of left-handedness; and when Paul condemns a straight man for fornicating with another man, that is NOT condemnation of homosexuality! A straight man who fornicates with the same gender and a homosexual are two totally different things. And the only way you could possibly say that they are the same thing is if you have a personal bias and INTENTIONALLY make yourself blind to the gargantuan differences between the two. Quite frankly, Rachel, unless you are a homosexual, I don’t see how the issue is any of your business in the first place since, if homosexuality is a sin, it has nothing to do with you and you are simply being a busy body and an antagonist by sticking your nose in other people’s business – which 1st Peter 4:15 condemns, “But let none of you suffer … as a busybody in other men's matters”.

Additionally, you say God doesn’t hate homosexuals and that you never said that He does. Is it not SINNERS that are cast into the Lake of Fire? God did not say that SIN would be cast into the Lake of Fire but the SINNERS. He did NOT say, “fear, and unbelief, and abominations, and murder, and whoredom, and witchcraft, and idolatry, and all lies, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone” – that is, He did not refer to the sins themselves. No, God said, “the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone” – that is, the DOERS of the sin, not the sin itself, shall be destroyed. You claim that God hates HOMOSEXUALITY, therefore you are saying that God must hate HOMOSEXUALS – because if homosexuality is a sin, it is HOMOSEXUALS who will receive the condemnation. Therefore you ARE saying that God hates homosexuals; for God does not forsake those He loves – and those that are damned are most certainly forsaken. ALL people are sinners and therefore all people are condemnable and eternally damned without Christ – but it is you who have singled out homosexuality as “sin” and therefore you condemn homosexuals; and you condemn homosexuals because you believe God condemns homosexuality.

Do you not see this circular game you are playing? You cannot say that God hates homosexuality but does not hate homosexuals. Does God not hate the sin AND the vessel which commits the sin, calling them “vessels of wrath fitted to destruction” [Romans 9:22]? Does God not hate the sin of murder AND the murderer himself? OF COURSE HE DOES, because He Himself said, “murderers shall have their place in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone”. Therefore, by your condemnation of homosexuals, you cast aside the mercy of the New Testament in Jesus Christ and the liberality we have in Him which says, “All things are lawful unto me” [1st Cor 6:12]. And what does the New Testament say to your judgment? “With what judgment ye judge, ye shall be judged: and with what measure ye mete, it shall be measured to you again.” And what does that mean? It means that because you deem homosexuality to be a sin and you have condemned homosexuality and thereby condemned homosexuals, YOU will be condemned with the SAME CHARGE. That’s right, you will be charged and condemned for homosexuality, because you have dared to claim the power to dictate what sin is and thereby condemn - a power which belongs to God alone. Jesus Himself spoke of homosexuals THREE times – all in favorable terms (Luke 17:34, Matthew 19:12, Matthew 8:5-13) – and will you still play the Pharisee, the superior one, by insisting that God hates homosexuality? It is this kind of thinking that Jesus condemned, and which creates such needless hostility between Christians and non-believers, and creates divisions within the body of Christ.

As to posting in our Forum, of course you can post there. I’m confused as to why you thought you couldn’t, since you saw the heading in the Guestbook that the commentary you left should have been posted in the Forum. But I really don’t know what it is that you would have to say in the forum since you refuse to discuss with me what it is you think the Bible says against homosexuals. You merely keep repeating that God said it’s a sin. Why won’t you say exactly what it is in the Scriptures that leads you to believe that being a homosexual is sinful? What words, specifically, has led you to believe this? If you don’t want to tell me here in an email, please come to our Forum and tell us. Our Forum is not a coliseum where you are the victim and we are the hecklers in the stands. Our Forum is a table at which you may pull up a chair and converse about the Word of God – so long as you respect the fact gays have been emotionally and physically abused by antigay people, and if you are going to discuss an opposing view you need to do so with kindness, rather than with the callus stoicism you’ve demonstrated so far. It’s up to you, but I for one would really know exactly what it is in Scripture that you’ve read which makes you so hard-hearted and merciless toward gays.

-Rev. Jim

[Rev. Jim Cunningham]

CONTINUING DEBATE.............


Jim,

Okay I'll explain why I'm so concerned if you want me to. I saw reports on how homosexuals have their lifespans cut in half so i have gotten to the point where I truly believe that being gay is dangerous for people's body, mind, and soul. If you truly thought that someone was doing something possibly very dangerous wouldn't you try to convince the person otherwise? Now do you understand? It's not out of hatred that I'm speaking against the gay lifestyle but rather out of concern. -Rachel

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Rachel,

Thank you for telling me this. I can always appreciate someone's sincere concern for the health and well-being of others.

As a minister and educator I have seen a few of those reports, and I'm sad to say that they are 100% propaganda and fear tactics from the same people who try to use religion against homosexuals.

As to the physical dangers of same gender sex, God built human beings to be able to physically join regardless of the gender of the persons. It is not my intent to be graphic (and I am assuming that you are an adult) but I assure you - as untold numbers of unbiased doctors can tell you - for those who desire to engage in anal intercourse, the male body can most certainly join with another male body without harm. Furthermore males have high erogenous zones in the anal region that women do not possess, mostly due to the precisely placed prostate glan. For decency's sake, I will go no further here in the description of how completely compatible male intercourse is. But that's even presuming that they are engaging in physical activity. It is false to think that all homosexual men engage in anal penetration; many have no interest in it whatsoever, and I know couples who have been together for years who have never engaged in anal intercourse. Nevertheless, not only do a great many heterosexuals also engage in anal intercourse, what is more important is that the Bible itself does not condemn anal intercourse, and it is clearly written "Where no law is, there is no transgression". God never forbade any particular sex acts - He only demanded that the sex acts be done within a marriage. But self-righteous people have made laws prohibiting gays from marrying, forcing them to live in fornication. Don't you see Rachel, no matter how noble you think that you are being, you cannot dictate to other people what they can do in bed just because you are concerned about them based on some bigoted and decidedly one-sided reports. The "physical dangers" between two members of the same gender are no different than for members of the opposite gender. Millions of homosexuals can testify to that fact regardless of what any biased report says. Again, the nonsense that homosexual intercourse is "dangerous" is a tool of antigay propaganda – and, unfortunately, obviously the tactic worked if you have believed it. As to sexually transmitted diseases, heterosexuals have the highest rates. And in the matter of HIV/AIDS, the United Nations' World Health Organization reports that black heterosexual females have the highest cases.

Another propaganda tool used by these gay haters is to convince people that homosexuals are emotionally depressed and unhappy, and that they cannot achieve true happiness in their relationships. Rachel, I cannot express enough how totally insane that view is. It is an astronomical lie. Gay couples live happy lives just like heterosexual couples. However, I'll tell you what IS true. Homosexuals have endured emotional, physical, legal and religious persecution for centuries, being told they are sub-human and worse than murderers. They have been tortured, murdered, humiliated, rejected by their parents, their family, their friends, their school, their community, their society, their country, and, worst of all, the Christian Church which has been the single largest and continuous instigator of degradation, discrimination, and persecution against homosexuals. And because homosexuals are constantly lied to and taught that they are worthless and psychologically warped, or even possessed by devils, many actually come to believe such lies. They aren’t unhappy because they are homosexual, they are unhappy because they have been taught that they are abnormal and need to be “cured”.

Did you know, Rachel, that in 1954, when racial segregation was still a major issue in America, psychological experiments were done on young Black school children. There was even a documentary on PBS about it which showed the old film footage. A table was set up at the front of the class and psychologists sat at the table facing the class. The experiment involved a child being called to the table and presented with two dolls. Both of these dolls were completely identical except for the skin and hair color. One doll was white with yellow hair, while the other was brown with black hair. The child was then asked questions inquiring as to which doll they would play with, which one is the nice doll, which one looks bad, which one has the nicer color, etc. The experiment showed a clear preference for the white doll among all children in the study. These findings exposed internalized racism in African-American children, self-hatred that was more acute among children attending segregated schools. It was a reflection of what the persecution of the White culture had instilled in them. We know that there is nothing wrong with being Black, but they had been taught by a White society that being Black was bad! As a result these poor innocent Black children had developed a self-loathing that they would never have had if they had not endured degradation from society. This is EXACTLY the same situation that gays endured, to the point that many homosexuals were forced to suppress their sexual identity and enter fraudulent heterosexual marriages. But in recent years, as the Gay Rights Movement progressed, society in general has become more enlightened to the persecution of homosexuals. In the past, most gays who were brave enough had to secretly meet in hidden places, with the only real social settings being bars in seedy neighborhoods, which were constantly subjected to brutal police raids and incarceration. Then one night in 1969, when the police raided a gay bar called the Stonewall Inn in Greenwich Village, the gay people there decided that they had had enough. They rose up and fought back in a massive riot that lasted three days. It made global news and slowly over time America started to see the injustice perpetrated against homosexuals. Gay and lesbian community centers were started, Oprah spoke out against anti-gay persecution, churches were formed where gays were welcomed, gay characters began appearing on TV shows, and some states even began protecting the marriage rights of gays. Gays in many places began to feel safer to come out of the closet and many organizations were formed for support. A large portion of the gay community has been able to stand up to the persecution and shake off the psychological assault. The hatred still wounds their hearts, but they have the strength of the support of one another to accept who they are rather than despise themselves. Sadly the persecution rages on, led by the theological terrorists who seek to shove gays back into their closets with their fear tactics, trying to convince society that gays are all miserable, child molesting deviants who want to destroy heterosexual marriages.

Rachel, homosexuals are ordinary people who live the same lives that heterosexuals live; the only difference is that they are not attracted to the opposite gender. They fall in love just like heterosexuals do. And they only seek to be treated as equals. There is a massive community of Christians who are gay and lesbian all over the world. Most of them have been literally kicked out of their churches when they revealed that they were only attracted to the same gender. Many of them even believed the church’s lie that they had to become heterosexual to be saved and they subjected themselves to cults who tried to change them. When you have a moment, take a look at this page on my website with brief video testimonials from people who have gone through "ex-gay therapy". Some mutilate their bodies or commit suicide because, when they couldn’t make themselves be attracted to the opposite gender, they were told that they weren’t trying hard enough or that they weren’t praying hard enough or that they didn’t love God enough.

So you see, Rachel, whatever harm or danger homosexuals MIGHT encounter in their relationships, it cannot remotely be compared to what has been done to them by heterosexuals. And if any Christian can say that such heinous behavior toward homosexuals is acceptable to God, then they do not speak on behalf of the God of the Bible. Homosexuals should be allowed to live their lives in peace, to marry the person they love, and have the right to care for one another. The only danger a homosexual truly faces is prejudice of the self-righteous. I shutter to think of what God will do to those people who have committed such persecution – especially when that persecution has been committed against those who call on His name. As Jesus said, it would be better that a millstone be tied around their neck and that they be drowned in the sea, rather than harm His children.

-Rev. Jim

[Rev. Jim Cunningham]

CONTINUING DEBATE........................

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Jim, Oh and also I came across this verse, 1 Corinthians 7:2, "But since there is so much immorality, each man should have his own wife and each woman her own husband". – Rachel

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Rachel,

You said, “I came across this verse, 1 Corinthians 7:2, "But since there is so much immorality, each man should have his own wife and each woman her own husband".

I see here that you are quoting the NIV. Throughout my website I quote only the KJV and I demonstrate why it is the only valid English translation of the Scriptures. The NIV is not only anti-gay, it is also anti-Christ. If you go to our website and click on WHY YOU SHOULD ONLY TRUST THE KJV you can read my brief article about this. I am not able to debate doctrine using the NIV because it is not the Word of God. This verse is a perfect example. The Word of God in the KJV says something very different from the NIV.

The KJV says,
“Now, concerning the things whereof ye wrote unto me: It is good for a man not to touch a woman. Nevertheless, to avoid fornication, let every man have his own wife, and let every woman have her own husband.”

As you can see, that is very different from what the NIV says.

The subject that Paul is discussing with the Corinthians is not about heterosexuality vs. homosexuality. The Corinthians had written Paul some unknown question and he was replying, saying in essence that it is better not to have sex AT ALL – but, if you must have sex you must do it within marriage to avoid fornication. This isn’t the first time he’s said this, such as “But I speak this by permission, and not of commandment. For I would that all men were even as I myself. But every man hath his proper gift of God, one after this manner, and another after that. I say therefore to the unmarried and widows, It is good for them if they abide even as I. But if they cannot contain, let them marry: for it is better to marry than to burn.”

The problem here is that you are missing the context of what Paul is saying and you are focusing in on the male/female husband/wife in the sentence and implying that the point is heterosexuality. But if we were to ignore the real context and allow your interpretation, then I could also take the first part of the verse out of context by saying that “It is not good for a man to touch a woman” is proof that heterosexuality is a sin. The majority of the world’s population is heterosexual so obviously the Bible will speak in the majority, as when the Bible repeatedly speaks of right-handedness as though there were no left-handed people. God always speaks to the majority while automatically including the minority. The Scriptures are also directed at females, even though it seems written to men; for example, when Jesus said, “I say unto you that whosoever looketh on a woman to lust after her hath committed adultery with her already in his heart,”was he only referring to men? Does that mean that women are allowed to lust after men just because it’s not mentioned? Of course not; the POINT of the verse is that ANYONE who lusts after another person in their heart has committed adultery with them even though they did not do so physically – and the GENDER of the person was irrelevant, which is exactly why He says “WHOSOEVER LOOKETH” instead of “if a man looketh” or “if a woman looketh”.

So I’m afraid 1st Corinthians 7:2 is not a valid anti-gay verse.

-Rev. Jim